Children of Earth - Day Five

[fictional]

Hahahahah. Seriously?

I reject this reality.

You know, I'm a Rusty apologist from way back. I am, truly. He's created some of the most amazing characters and stories; I have always been grateful (and still am!) but, omg, what a hack!

(This is not to be interpreted as go tell him so, or take any action whatsoever. See above: I remain grateful.)

I am not pissed off because he killed Ianto. At all.

You know what I'm pissed about? He killed Torchwood, and he killed Jack, and he didn't even do it well.

I'm not mad at Jack for sacrificing his grandson. Because hey, when it's one child to save millions, sure, that's what you do. And a hero sacrifices his own child before he sacrifices someone else's. Fine. Okay. Got it.

BUT OMG, TECHNOBABBLE WAS THE REASON THAT HE NEEDS TO DO THIS? TECHNOBABBLE??!?? No, Torchwood, with their classic skin-of-the-teeth rescue... in which we make Jack devour his own young?

Why, what possible reason is there, aside from killing the franchise, to put your heroes in this position?

I don't hate him for making that choice in that position -- what else could he do? -- what I do hate is that before that, he gave up. HE GAVE UP.

And fuck me, but after Ianto died, you fight! YOU THINK OF SOMETHING. My Jack would have fought. He wouldn't have sat there with his head in his hands like a great, useless article...No. Just, no. IANTO WOULD BE SO ASHAMED OF YOU.

You're telling me Sarah Jane's super computer wouldn't have been helpful? And Martha's on her honeymoon? What the fuck? The whole point of having the show NOT go global, was that the Doctor never needed to visit. But okay, you made it bigger, but NOW IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

It was so out of universe, it wasn't even funny.

Why was so little of this episode focused on Torchwood? Why did we care more about Frobisher and Bridget than we did about, you know, the team??? Why? That's asinine. And then, no Torchwood at the end either, no rebuilding, no "we go on."

It's not just like killing something, it's like salting the earth on the way out.

Way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, yet again, Rusty. Thanks. I haven't been so fucking disappointed in a really long time.


ETA: Euros Lyn, however, is still a god. It was still beautiful to look at. Bring on Steven Moffat to Doctor Who, sexism and all. I don't care.

ETA Part Deux: I was SO FUCKING PLEASED to see that the final S. Asian character, "Mr. Patel", was the compliant person dragging the kids away from the white teacher, screaming, "you can't do that." Nice, RTD. Nice.

Comments

[quinn222.livejournal.com]

They couldn't do any of those sensible things because how could they turn Torchwood in the The Super Cooper show (tm: spiderine) if they didn't get rid of Jack and Ianto?

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

I am, like, so filled with sputtering rage, I don't even know what to say. I just... what did I just watch???

[antelope-writes.livejournal.com]

An interesting, deep, extraordinary character get tortured into madness.

And the end of Torchwood. There's no way they can rebuild the show after that.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

I, uh, see why Barrowman was so pissed.

[antelope-writes.livejournal.com]

Even if you assume that he has no love for his character at all...which isn't true, JB's said he loves Jack many times...Captain Jack in Who and TW has been a good source of reliable, high-profile work for him, and for all the rest of them. Putting that character through the shredder not only means he needs new work, it means that the folks dumb/blind enough to not equate John Barrowman with Jack Harkness are going to make his life difficult from now on.

I bet GDL was furious with the ending too.

[kel-reiley.livejournal.com]

what you didn't just watch was torchwood
i repeat, it was NOT torchwood

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

It was like, a movie loosely based on Torchwood.

[kel-reiley.livejournal.com]

it was like a movie made by someone who heard about torchwood and thought it sounded cool

[magnetgirl.livejournal.com]

IT'S THE FOX/BBC PILOT OF DOCTOR WHO
The torchwood version!

Ian sez it makes serenity look like a really good adaptation of Firefly!

[51stcenturyfox.livejournal.com]

Why was so little of this episode focused on Torchwood? Why did we care more about Frobisher and Bridget than we did about, you know, the team??? Why? That's asinine. And then, no Torchwood at the end either, no rebuilding, no "we go on."

I wanted that. I really did.

Blah.

I have thoughts on characterization. I just have to formulate them in my noggin.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

Yeah. It was like... Children of Earth, featuring, occasionally things that look Torchwood-ish if you squint. They just... defanged them completely.

[51stcenturyfox.livejournal.com]

There were actually loads of things I liked about this... I just wanted... more team. Episode three. Nice. New temporary headquarters and the team working together.

I've said this elsewhere, but Stephen's death is more than enough pain for Jack. Ianto was just gratuitous.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

They were bystanders through the whole thing. They were so passive. That wasn't the Torchwood I signed up for.

I actually thought Stephen's death was way worse than Ianto's because it was so pointless. There were so many ways to get that message across that wouldn't have ripped down the show.

And like, that moment where Gwen's making the documentary. Why? The world wasn't ending. It was so useless! And then they gave it to us twice, just to fuck with us. It's like Rose saying at the end of Doomsday, this is the day that I died. You didn't die. Or Journey's end: "The doctor's most faithful companion will die" BUT IT DIDN'T. It's hack writing, just to make your heartstrings vibrate.

And, and... it was so static! Even the beautiful shots, were all of still moments: Jack on the chair, alone at the end, or vanishing through the double doors. It didn't move.

[kel-reiley.livejournal.com]

They were bystanders through the whole thing. They were so passive. That wasn't the Torchwood I signed up for.

exactly! that was not "Torchwood: outside the gov't, beyond the police!"

that was... i still don't know what the fuck it was

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

I really did think it was spectacular tv up to ep. 5. Not Torchwood, but spectacular.

[santousha.livejournal.com]

word

[justaotherwitch.livejournal.com]

Yes. This.

In the end, I have to say that CoE was good. It was really fucking good television. But it wasn't my show. It was well written, directed, and acted and I would have loved it, if it wasn't supposed to be Torchwood.

I can't imagine wanting to watch a fourth season, because what the hell would it be? I thought Gwen was awesome in this, but it's not enough to carry me on without something else really amazing happening.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

See, I thought that up to the beginning of this ep, which I just thought made no sense.

I keep seeing everyone's posts being like, "well, it was gutting, but amazing" and I really did think that about Ep. 4, but this... it just missed. For me.

[darthhellokitty.livejournal.com]

It even fucked up the Doctor for me, because where the hell was he? Fucking Doctor Who.

I'm glad it's over with.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and I'm so pissed because I really loved the beginning. Just.. this, what... it took the Torchwood out of the show! I just.. how can that seem like a good idea?

[mellacita.livejournal.com]

Just.. this, what... it took the Torchwood out of the show! I just.. how can that seem like a good idea?

My problem, too. Take away the fact that you need a guy who can't die, and pretty much the Torchwood Team's roles could have been original characters and the story would still work.

Was a great show, but wasn't my show.

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

Right. And it could so easily have been, that's the other problem. Jesus christ.

[seres-mimosa.livejournal.com]

I have enjoyed reading your reaction posts even though I disagree re Ianto's death. I felt that Ianto's death was pointless, it served no purpose to plot or characterization - except to give Jack the classic death of lover angst. Episode 5 confirmed this for me because it showed a broken Jack, a Jack defeated and given up. I resent Ianto being reduced to girlfriend canon fodder but I can live with pointless death because all death is pointless. (Tosh who death was also pointless/emotionally manipulative, atleast had a fierce heroic death saving the world.

That Jack gave up instead of fighting to avenge Ianto's death ... was jarringly odd. That Jack needed no other prompting to get back into the fight than being taken out of his cells was even more so. I agree completely, it's been a wonderful 5 episode story ... just not really about Torchwood? RTD did warn about that to be fair :/

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I loved Torchwood (the organization, as an entity). I can see why people who didn't thought it was so spectacular.

[elainasaunt.livejournal.com]

*retreats to old fandom* I can't deal with it. For nearly a year I've been using TW/DW fandom to escape from the fact that work sucks (and I'm a freelancer, so how fucked up is that?). Today, I'm escaping into work (and it's Saturday, so how fucked up is that?).

[kalichan.livejournal.com]

Pretty fucked up. *hugs*

*laughs* no one will ever believe me, because of Traveling, but I never really shipped J/I. That's way more rm's bag. Like... I believe Jack loves him, and was "in love" with him as far as he could be, which frankly isn't that much, whatever that means, and that Ianto was head over heels for Jack... but I never thought it should or would last. Or was in any way different than the way Jack felt for his wife, or whatever.

I loved Ianto because he was broken and insane. And Jack was really fucking broken and insane. And that's why they were together. But it didn't matter, because that's what insane people should do: get together and channel it into saving the world.

I'm just sad for Torchwood today. Really, really, really depressed and sad. I liked this island of misfit toys, and I felt like last night, I was told that they were useless and stupid, and stood around watching while other people did stuff, and never asked for help when it was so clear that they needed it.

The parallels between the Doctor burning Gallifrey, and Jack sacrificing his grandson were pretty stark, but look at it:

In the Library, the Doctor's all: "Look me up..." and the aliens run away.

Here Ianto's like, "He's Captain Jack Harkness... look him up," and the aliens laugh and kill him.

And I get it, TW was never meant to deal with threats on this order of magnitude, not without support, not as a little band of five three rift monitors in Cardiff. Why tell that story then? Unless you hate them?

[monkat.livejournal.com]

I noted the in the Library "Look me up"/in Thames House "Look him up" parallel. But, what would 456 find if they looked up Jack? Little or nothing. He's been hunkered down, hiding out and waiting for his Doctor for over a century. Not really flee-in-terror stuff, there. (That's not a slight to Jack. Given where he was, what he had, and what had happened, tucking up and waiting seems like a good choice -- except it made him distant and disconnected.)

I also noted the "I came back for you"/"Are you ever coming back?" "What for?" contrast between the beginning of Kiss Kiss Bang Bang and the end of Day 5. Jack no longer has a reason to stay. And while being able to move on is usually character advancement, in this case, it's a retreat. He's not moving on because he's learned and grown; he's retreating.

The thing is, I don't think anyone got to "learn and grow" in CoE. (Oddly, this was driven home by that little revelation that we actually knew nothing about Ianto.) The monsters may have been momentarily turned aside -- politicians, human nature, aliens, man's inhumanity to man -- everyone suffered, and ultimately did so for nothing. Courage, stupidity, awesome-sauce, vileness...and in the end, the survivors, like the audience, were left wanting to assume a foetal curl and weep uncontrollably.

Speaking of. I'm left desperately wanting to not think about this any more. And how screwed up is that, needing to not think about telly?

[rm.livejournal.com]

I actually think Ianto got to learn and grow in CoE, but I also inhaled a bunch of tie-in novels and the radio plays before this, and he had a very clear, solid arc there and died a better/hppier man than where he started.

[seres-mimosa.livejournal.com]

"I loved Ianto because he was broken and insane. And Jack was really fucking broken and insane. And that's why they were together. But it didn't matter, because that's what insane people should do: get together and channel it into saving the world."

THIS. This was why I shipped it... And because they were so darn beautiful while they were at it :)

[elainasaunt.livejournal.com]

I'm just sad for Torchwood today.

Yeah. Yeah, me too. At the same time, well, it's been quite a journey, hasn't it?

"Being here, I've seen things I never dreamt I'd see. Loved people I never would have known if I'd just stayed where I was. And I wouldn't change that for the world."

[rm.livejournal.com]

IANTO WOULD BE SO ASHAMED OF YOU.


This, and I can't shake that, and I feel like Jack did all that shit for that reaosn, because as someone on my friendslist said, Jack hates himself more than Snape ever did.

So hey, dude, let's reboot the shit out of this, yeah?

[exbentley]

Where was Sarah Jane! Why didn't she take one look at all her kiddie protoges talking in unison and get her act together and do something about it! I find it odd that one of the Whoniverse's most competent side-characters, whose show is about how close she is to children, was so overlooked. I kept expecting her to show up.

That aside, I think I am possibly the only person in fandom who is not like "EVERYTHING IS RUINED FOREVER AND EVER" and I am still trying to vocalize why this has all made me so happy. That was the best episode of Torchwood I have ever seen. Maybe because I waited and marathonned 2-5 so I didn't have that process of stewing and denial and discussion and theorizing that turns uncomfortable plot twists into truly obnoxious ones.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Nah, I'm okay. Just.... jesus. Gut punched.

[exbentley]

Oh, me too, I feel like my heart stuttered during a few of those scenes. Like you said somewhere else (or I think it was you) — it's somehow harder identifying with and adoring the love left alive than it is with the character who died. But it's sort of a glorious sadness. I'm wrecked, but it doesn't have the sense of bitterness that, say, Deathly Hallows left me with.

[rm.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that was me. Patty keeps trying to comfort me, and I'm like "no no, you don't need to pet me, you need to let me hold you very tight so I know you're still here."

[demotu.livejournal.com]

BUT OMG, TECHNOBABBLE WAS THE REASON THAT HE NEEDS TO DO THIS? TECHNOBABBLE??!??

AH YES. THANK YOU. BECAUSE I HATED IT FOR EXACTLY THIS REASON. IT WASN'T "WE NEED TO KILL STEPHEN TO FIX THE PLOT" IT WAS "WE NEED TO KILL STEPHEN, LET'S CREATE THE PLOT."

Arg.

Torture of children and parents is probably my weak spot, in terms of horrible things that can happen in fiction. I'm actually not sure I would have watched that had I known what was going to happen. Definitely not last night, at any rate.